Metal Gear Topics

Big Boss' Age - A Time Paradox
After confirmation of Solid Snake's year of birth with the release of MGS3, the speculations over Solid Snake's age are finally settled. My estimate analysis from 2002 turned out to be pretty accurate, didn't it. That's one thing settled. Thus we step up to tackle the even more illusive question of Big Boss' age. It might seem that with the release of MGS3, there are now more information to go on, but that is in reality not the case. Because to accommodate the storyline of MGS3, Director Kojima retroactively changed some of the almost two decade old time line continuities established by the previous releases of the series. Among the retroactive continuity (retcon) changes is the formation year of the High Tech Special Force Group Fox Hound. Originally it was 1990, in MGS3 it got changed to 1971. Another change is the age of Revolver Ocelot. And another is the age frame of Big Boss. What I want to attempt to explore, is whether it is possible to forge a logical explanation of the two different sets of time lines so that they fit into one. Big Boss was said to be in his late 50's when the three Snakes were born/cloned. With the birth/clone year of 1972 being established in the game ending time line of MGS3, Big Boss was then in his late 50's in 1972. Making him, in 1964, the year of the Virtuous and Snake Eater missions, approximately in the end of his 40's. And when he became the student of The Boss in 1950, he was in his mid 30's. We have the key dates and ages: 1950, became student of The Boss, Big Boss mid 30's. 1964, Snake Eater Operation, Big Boss end of 40's. 1972, birth of the clones, Big Boss late 50's. 1995, Outer Heaven Crisis, Big Boss late 70's to early 80's. 1999, Zanzibarland Uprising, Big Boss mid 80's. We have Big Boss' age. But we do not yet have Naked Snake's age. For even though the same person, between Big Boss and Naked Snake's ages, there is an unexplainable time paradox. We now go into estimation and speculation: 1972, Big Boss late 50's. Assign it a hypothetical number, 57 or 58. Then in 1964, Big Boss was 49 or 50. Here comes the conundrum. According to Director Kojima, The Boss was about 50 years old ("50歳くらい") during the Snake Eater mission. Which can sensibly be assumed to be perhaps 52 or 53. With Big Boss being hypothetically 49 at the time, the age difference is only 3 to 4 years. For one to be considered a parent figure to the other, the age gap is too small. Big Boss' first combat experience was said to be the Korean War (6.25.1950 ～ 7.27.1953). In 1950, Big Boss would be 35. That is not an usual age for a soldier to be in his first combat. 1950 was also the year Big Boss became student of The Boss. Big Boss 35, The Boss 38. The age difference between the two is just too small. For the two of them to fight side by side for the 10 years following, going in and out of life and death situations, and develop the love not of a man and a woman, but of a mother and a son, with such a small age difference, is somewhat unreasonable. Even less reasonably, at the end of MGS3, we see carved on The Boss' tombstone the years "192X ～ 1964". If The Boss was born on 1929, she was 35 years old at 1964. If The Boss was born on 1920, she was 44 years old at 1964. Considering Big Boss was hypothetically 49 at the time, either he must be younger, or she must be older. An explanation could be that the date carved on the tombstone was a cover date, or a fake date used in order to not give away the identity of the person occupying the grave. (Regardless the fact that The Boss's body was not really buried there.) Director Kojima did say The Boss was about 50 years old in the game after all, and a 192X birth definitely contradicts with that statement. With all that said, it just seems that the Naked Snake we saw in MGS3 was definitely younger than 49 years of age. Logically, we know Naked Snake is definitely younger than 49 years old in MGS3. Hypothetically 10 years younger than The Boss, if not more. This would mean 42 years old at 1964. (Or 34 by the tombstone date.) But that would also make Big Boss 50 (42) years old in 1972, which contradicts with his profile of being in his late 50's at the time of the Les Enfants Terribles Project. And also make him 73 (65) in 1995 during the Outer Heaven Crisis. And subsequently 77 (69) in 1999 during the Zanzibarland Uprising. Both contradicting with Big Boss' profile of being in his 80's at the time of the two incidents. I would have liked to explore the topic some more, but it would only feel like I'm dwelling on a dead issue. So I'll just make my conclusion here. Even though seemingly almost possible, it is actually not possible to incorporate the new time line information introduced in MGS3 into the original time line established in the previous games. It is not possible to logically explain Naked Snake's age against Big Boss' age. There is simply no way to logicalize the retroactive continuity changes to the almost two decade old time line Director Kojima made with MGS3. It is a time paradox. 4.24.07

Big Boss' Age - A Time Paradox

After confirmation of Solid Snake's year of birth with the release of MGS3, the speculations over Solid Snake's age are finally settled. My estimate analysis from 2002 turned out to be pretty accurate, didn't it.
That's one thing settled.

Thus we step up to tackle the even more illusive question of Big Boss' age.

It might seem that with the release of MGS3, there are now more information to go on, but that is in reality not the case. Because to accommodate the storyline of MGS3, Director Kojima retroactively changed some of the almost two decade old time line continuities established by the previous releases of the series.
Among the retroactive continuity (retcon) changes is the formation year of the High Tech Special Force Group Fox Hound. Originally it was 1990, in MGS3 it got changed to 1971.
Another change is the age of Revolver Ocelot.
And another is the age frame of Big Boss.

What I want to attempt to explore, is whether it is possible to forge a logical explanation of the two different sets of time lines so that they fit into one.

Big Boss was said to be in his late 50's when the three Snakes were born/cloned.
With the birth/clone year of 1972 being established in the game ending time line of MGS3, Big Boss was then in his late 50's in 1972.
Making him, in 1964, the year of the Virtuous and Snake Eater missions, approximately in the end of his 40's.
And when he became the student of The Boss in 1950, he was in his mid 30's.

We have the key dates and ages:
1950, became student of The Boss, Big Boss mid 30's.
1964, Snake Eater Operation, Big Boss end of 40's.
1972, birth of the clones, Big Boss late 50's.
1995, Outer Heaven Crisis, Big Boss late 70's to early 80's.
1999, Zanzibarland Uprising, Big Boss mid 80's.

We have Big Boss' age.

But we do not yet have Naked Snake's age.
For even though the same person, between Big Boss and Naked Snake's ages, there is an unexplainable time paradox.

We now go into estimation and speculation:
1972, Big Boss late 50's.
Assign it a hypothetical number, 57 or 58.
Then in 1964, Big Boss was 49 or 50.

Here comes the conundrum.
According to Director Kojima, The Boss was about 50 years old ("50歳くらい") during the Snake Eater mission.
Which can sensibly be assumed to be perhaps 52 or 53.
With Big Boss being hypothetically 49 at the time, the age difference is only 3 to 4 years. For one to be considered a parent figure to the other, the age gap is too small.

Big Boss' first combat experience was said to be the Korean War (6.25.1950 ～ 7.27.1953).
In 1950, Big Boss would be 35. That is not an usual age for a soldier to be in his first combat.

1950 was also the year Big Boss became student of The Boss.
Big Boss 35, The Boss 38.
The age difference between the two is just too small.
For the two of them to fight side by side for the 10 years following, going in and out of life and death situations, and develop the love not of a man and a woman, but of a mother and a son, with such a small age difference, is somewhat unreasonable.

Even less reasonably, at the end of MGS3, we see carved on The Boss' tombstone the years "192X ～ 1964".
If The Boss was born on 1929, she was 35 years old at 1964.
If The Boss was born on 1920, she was 44 years old at 1964.
Considering Big Boss was hypothetically 49 at the time, either he must be younger, or she must be older.
An explanation could be that the date carved on the tombstone was a cover date, or a fake date used in order to not give away the identity of the person occupying the grave. (Regardless the fact that The Boss's body was not really buried there.)
Director Kojima did say The Boss was about 50 years old in the game after all, and a 192X birth definitely contradicts with that statement.

With all that said, it just seems that the Naked Snake we saw in MGS3 was definitely younger than 49 years of age.

Logically, we know Naked Snake is definitely younger than 49 years old in MGS3. Hypothetically 10 years younger than The Boss, if not more.
This would mean 42 years old at 1964. (Or 34 by the tombstone date.)
But that would also make Big Boss 50 (42) years old in 1972, which contradicts with his profile of being in his late 50's at the time of the Les Enfants Terribles Project.
And also make him 73 (65) in 1995 during the Outer Heaven Crisis.
And subsequently 77 (69) in 1999 during the Zanzibarland Uprising.
Both contradicting with Big Boss' profile of being in his 80's at the time of the two incidents.

I would have liked to explore the topic some more, but it would only feel like I'm dwelling on a dead issue. So I'll just make my conclusion here.

Even though seemingly almost possible, it is actually not possible to incorporate the new time line information introduced in MGS3 into the original time line established in the previous games.
It is not possible to logically explain Naked Snake's age against Big Boss' age.
There is simply no way to logicalize the retroactive continuity changes to the almost two decade old time line Director Kojima made with MGS3.

It is a time paradox.

4.24.07

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